Avoid faster movement by abusing bunnyhop etc.

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Comments

  • Black BellamyBlack Bellamy Senior
    edited September 2014

    In any game where you fight other people you have to learn how to fight their play style and adjust. This isn't rock paper scissors. Adapting is a valid argument as it is the basis of every competitive game. You cannot expect to do the same thing every time and expect to win. People will learn to adapt and beat another person's play style. They are who set themselves apart from the average player. If you do not wish to do this, then there is no helping you, we are done here. I wish you a long happy time of playing PVK2.

    --kokoronokawari
    It would appear to me that we have a difference of opinion. Also another dumb thing is that unlike the SS the archer gets no accuracy penalty from jumping
    "Everything with a beginning has an end"
  • Ukyo KuonjiUkyo Kuonji Captain Main Senior
    edited 3:28PM
    Shrek or be shrekked.
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  • shabbashabba Senior
    edited 3:28PM
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    Your in denial when people melee in tf2 you dont see them jumping around its clearly still there in pvkii all it does is give a toxic feel to new players. Also as i said just have a cooldown on the times you can jump bam problem solved.
  • JediJedi Senior
    edited 3:28PM
    Hi,

    I think bunnyhoops should be removed. I play this game from many years and the only big difference between Awsome players and weaker players are this stupid jumps.

    Do u know how it looks when TWO PROS fights? They jump in and out, in and out, 10 people jumping like idiots and this is big advantage to pro players.

    The solution is simple. Slow down after jump like in every HL game, it will make game more static and less toxic for new players who cannot understand why they cant hit this jumping "Pro player".

    Then u will see there is no big difference between Pro and New players! It will force players to invent new tactics and dont go in alone to kill 10 guys cause they cant hit u when u jumping all the time.

    Regards Jedi
  • SphynxSphynx Senior
    edited July 2015
    I too had problems when I first encountered this, but you have to get used to it. Not every good player jumps constantly. If they do, it might be their personal strategy, but how much they jump during a fight doesn't really tell you how strong they are. Although some have mastered this strategy, players can easily put themselves at a disadvantage if they simply jump for the sake of it.

    A few important points to consider in your counter-strategy:

    PVKII is all about foreseeing your enemy's next move. If you find that someone tends to jump all the time, use this knowledge to your advantage. The following points could help:
    • Aim high – aim higher than you'd normally do in any other game if you want to hit a jumping player. In the end, you'll have to find the sweet spot for yourself, but as a rule of thumb, try to aim as if you'd like to hit someone standing on your head or slightly below.
    • Fully-charge your swings – good players who jump often attack with fully-charged swings. If you do the same, you and your enemy will both be stunned, but you'll not take any damage. This is especially important if you play against 'heavy-hitters' like the Heavy Knight and becomes less important against enemies who do less damage and hit at faster speeds, e.g. Skirmishers.
    • Do not get nervous if something goes wrong – do not start to run in order to eat or survive or if running is not part of your strategy. Jumping players will be fast and good ones will often manage to finish you off that way. If you feel you are dying anyways, why give your enemy an easy victory if you can atleast land another hit before you die? Believe me, it will make you a better player over time. Always think 'maximum damage output' for your team.
    • [Advanced] Use partially-charged swings to your advantage – especially if you made up your mind and want to land that last hit before you die or you are in a situation where you both only have to land a last swing, keep an eye on your enemy and – if they charge and you charge – estimate how long you can do so and – if it's necessary – release your swing in a partially-charged state to make sure you are definitely the first one to hit.
    • [Advanced] Good players will often assume you become nervous at low health levels – they might already expect a partially-charged swing and are trying to 'perfect-parry' [look that up if you don't know it, it's essential] it, so you can give them a good surprise if you play the 'I don't care'-card and simply fully-charge your swing no matter what happens.

    If you have any special situation you'd like some tips for, e.g. you are class x and your enemy is class y, then post it here and I'll try my best to give you some general advice.
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  • JediJedi Senior
    edited 3:28PM
    I dont have problems with jumping players cause as i said i play 3 years but im not the only one playing this game. It is so annoying and stupid when someone jump all the time and im sure u know what i mean. I remember moment when they put "slow down" after jump in Counter Strike and ppl stopped jumping, game started to be static. Every hl game-mod have slow after jump.

    Its stupid and idiotic when fight depends on jumping. Everyone knows that "slow after jump" is the basis for each HL game to be playable. Thats my opinion and as u can see not only me.

    Maybe you have some advices how to explain players this "difficult rules of game"? I mean to collect trasure, def. trincet etc.

    Regards Jedi
  • FinlordFinlord Senior
    edited 3:28PM
    Jumping is part of this mod and you dont have to play it if you dont like it. Just because other mods have slower jumping system doesn't mean that pvk should have it too.
  • Ukyo KuonjiUkyo Kuonji Captain Main Senior
    edited 3:28PM

    Shrek or be shrekked.

    Still applies :icon_viking2: :emot-awesome:
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  • KOKORONOKAWARIKOKORONOKAWARI Funny Little Japanese Drawing Person Senior
    edited 3:28PM
    Jedi wrote:

    Its stupid and idiotic when fight depends on jumping. Everyone knows that "slow after jump" is the basis for each HL game to be playable. Thats my opinion and as u can see not only me.


    1) You are comparing a shooting game to a melee game.
    2) People still b-hop in CS.
    3) Pressing the space bar isn't difficult.
    4) Hitting someone airborne where they are vulnerable for a thrust swing isn't difficult.
    5) Jumping isn't planned to be changed, you do not have to jump to play well, it adds dynamic fighting including like crouch swings etc. than simply jousting back and forth in a linear fashion.

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  • JediJedi Senior
    edited 3:28PM
    As Finlord said i just dont have to play it :D. This is one of the best mods of HL and could be the best melee game ever but not with players jumping all the time, 3 years of playing I have no doubt. I play so long and for 100% i cant tell u that only difference between best and normal players are this jumps, despite the fact that it looks idiotic. Game is very fast and chaotic and for me it should be more static to be playable and this is my opinion. Instead of "accelerating jumping" u could make simple dodge.

    I thought that this is forum where everyone can show his point of view but i was wrong. U create circle of mutual admiration and we'll see where it will lead You ;).

    Interesting is the fact, that u respond on this Topic not my Bondi special suggestion :D. Maybe thats why i prefer Chivalry....

    Regret Jedi
  • DisturvingDisturving Senior
    edited July 2015
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    The reason why my writing here is so formal is that people inevitably get annoyed at my writing, so sticking to the rules of formal writing is my attempt to avoid people taking me the wrong way and getting annoyed.
    Complaining and expressing disagreement and arguing are very good things to do.
    If something written by me here does not look formal, it may be because I tried to make it look better than it could were it formal, or it might be that it seems all right to me without it being formal.
  • Links121995Links121995 Beta Tester, Authorized Creator
    edited July 2015
    Jedi wrote:

    Reply to first post
    Hi, I greet you, and your redundant little comma too.

    I think bunnyhoops should be removed. I concur. Bunny hoops are the worst.

    The only big difference between Awsome players and weaker players are this stupid jumps. False. I've played this game for longer than you and have observed poor and average players employ jumping to no great effect. Jumping in the manner of a professional is as much a matter of skill as the standard, Earth-based Dance of Death.

    Do u know how it looks when TWO PROS fights? Yes.
    They jump in and out, in and out. No. I am living proof. I can attest to the power of simply magnetizing to one's target before they can escape to come around for another dive.
    10 people jumping like idiots and this is big advantage to pro players. I'd say the main advantage of professional players is that they're better than everybody else.

    The solution is simple. Counter their positioning (intended to counter the positioning of poor players that know not how to counter their positioning) with better positioning intended to counter their counter positioning.
    Slow down after jump like in every HL game. Oh.
    It will make game more static and less toxic for new players who cannot understand why they cant hit this jumping "Pro player". Is it not obvious? The Inexperienced player cannot yet aim and the professional is actively dodging. If they can't understand that... Could they ever hope to defeat the professional even on their own terms? Also, there's nothing toxic about being better/worse than another player. That's just life. We get better.

    Then u will see there is no big difference between Pro and New players! I hate to break it to ya, but there's a reason they're called "pro" instead of "old".

    It will force players to invent new tactics It won't. Jousting is an old tactic and works against new players that can't aim.

    And not go in alone to kill 10 guys. People seem to eschew teamwork, so it won't have that effect either.

    'Cause they cant hit u when u jumping all the time. They can't hit anything anyway! They can't even hit me in the back when I'm fighting an enemy! Except for those times when they hit me in the back. Those are always disappointing.

    Regards Jedi


    Reply to second post.
    i play 3 years but im not the only one playing this game. If only there were a way for new players to reach your skill level...
    It is so annoying and stupid when someone jump all the time and im sure u know what i mean. I'm more annoyed by the "Retreating strike" "Mindless flailing" "Keep rollin' rollin' rollin" and "moving around aimlessly" maneuvers.
    I remember moment when they put "slow down" after jump in Counter Strike and ppl stopped jumping, game started to be static. Every hl game-mod have slow after jump. Pointless anecdote.

    Its stupid and idiotic when fight depends on jumping. It is not the case that fights depend on jumps.
    Everyone knows that "slow after jump" is the basis for each HL game to be playable. Thats my opinion and as u can see not only me. It IS just your opinion. PVKII is evidence to a position that contradicts yours.

    Maybe you have some advices how to explain players this "difficult rules of game"? I mean to collect trasure, def. trincet etc. Such information is contained within loading screen tips. There should really be a list of them accessible from the main menu.

    Regards Jedi


    Reply to third post.
    As Finlord said i just dont have to play it :D/>. This is one of the best mods of HL and could be the best melee game ever but not with players jumping all the time. Make a stand. Literally. Keep your feet on the ground and demonstrate to the world that the best way to fight is with one's feet firmly on the ground. Refrain from complaining until the developers bring everybody down to your level.
    3 years of playing I have no doubt. Your argument has been around for longer than that.
    I play so long and for 100% i cant tell u that only difference between best and normal players are this jumps. Nope.
    Game is very fast and chaotic. That's fine.
    It should be more static to be playable. It's already playable.
    Instead of "accelerating jumping" u could make simple dodge. By Jove he's got it.

    I thought that this is forum where everyone can show his point of view but i was wrong. U create circle of mutual admiration and we'll see where it will lead You ;)/>. Your opinion is not a new one. We've seen it before. Personally, I'm tired of it.
    In melee range, jumping moves a player across an opponent's screen a significant distance at the speed of sudden.
    It's no different to suddenly moving in any other direction (although jumping is the one that works most often, other directions must be relative to the direction the enemy is moving in, and are invariably more effective when combined with jumping. Jumping over an opponent's head can also be quite disorienting for the victim, however, you haven't mentioned that once.)
    In my experience, players naturally look down, thus exacerbating the effect a jumping opponent will have on them.

    Your accursed smileys are decidedly not improving others' opinions of you.

    Interesting is the fact, that u respond on this Topic not my Bondi special suggestion :D/>. I'm pretty sure that your suggestion was not a very good one. Ah yes, poorly-executed rapid-fire or improper propulsion of a javelin. Trust me, throwing a particularly powerful javelin would look better with a heroic pose, a sparkling particle effect, a disembodied choir, and some god rays. It would not make a good balance for the Pirates' and Knights' ranged classes. It would meet them on their own terms. This is not the PVKII way. The Raven ideas are fine.


    Maybe thats why i prefer Chivalry.... You prefer it because people humor you there? You accuse all present of participation of a circle of mutual admiration and then you state that you prefer a circle of mutual admiration that just-so-happens to include you?

    Regret Jedi You spelled it right (miraculously) twice, and then you suddenly got it wrong. I just, I... Huh?


    I'm not a huge fan of jumping, nor am I a huge fan of poor arguments.
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  • MrMohoMrMoho Senior
    edited July 2015
    Oh dear, these rather "lacking" critics always makes me want to work them over to turn them into proper critic so people better see the critics point/ understand it properly and the critic doesn't just get put down by everyone.To do that, however, I have to see or at least partly agree with your point. I don't.

    There was a time were I believe jumping increased your speed slightly, allowing slower classes to catch up or earlier arrive at spots they otherwise wouldn't. That's no longer the case, I even tested it to be sure.

    As long as jumping is as fast as the normal movementspeed, I don't see a problem with it. In combat it is only annoying if you don't expect him to jump at all. Otherwise a well placed crouch is just as effective.

    The only problem I might have with jumping is the fact that you can perform certain things at a normal movementspeed like blocking or pulling a bow that normaly would slow you down.

    Also, a important side-note for everyone in this world, do not tell somebody that he doesn't have to play the game when he would like a game mechanic to be changed, even if he is stubborn about it.
  • Ukyo KuonjiUkyo Kuonji Captain Main Senior
    edited 3:28PM
    Just because every other Source game slows you down when jumping doesn't mean PVK has to. Just be thankful you don't get a speed boost from jumping :icon_pirate2:
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  • JollyRogerJollyRoger Members, Senior
    edited 3:28PM
    The only issue I have with with jump spam is the transition from crouch to stand with the animations, when done just right it makes the player warp up and down insanely fast over and over.
  • BagasBagas Senior
    edited 3:28PM
    Damn dinahs! Always crying in the forums...
    First perfect parry, now jumps...
    What will be next? Do you guys want to ruin the game? L2p
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  • ColonelColonel Finger Lickin' Good PVKII Team
    edited October 2015
    This is quite the old thread, and don't need any more unnecessary posting, so i'm going to lock this.

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