For all the Scandinavians

The NibelungThe Nibelung Senior
edited 3:55PM in General Discussion
Blattar Br

Comments

  • FinlordFinlord Senior
    edited 3:55PM
    For Swedish you mean? None else can understand what they are talking about.
  • edited 3:55PM
    Why do these Turkish people all look like fat trolls?
  • The NibelungThe Nibelung Senior
    edited June 2014
    snip
  • edited 3:55PM
    Enzo wrote:

    Why do these Turkish people all look like fat trolls?
  • GnoberGnober Senior
    edited 3:55PM
    Enzo wrote:

    Why do these Turkish people all look like fat trolls?


    Because it is a racist cartoon... It seems to be a critique of multicultural society, I'm not interely sure, I don't understand swedish that well... There is a lot of hatred towards muslims in the Scandinavian countries...
  • The NibelungThe Nibelung Senior
    edited June 2014
    snip
  • eggzoreggzor Senior
    edited 3:55PM
    Hellsten wrote:

    Look up the word racism please. There's nothing in this video stating that muslims, immigrants or any kind of ethnicity would be of less worth than another. If that's your interpretation then I guess we both know what I could call you. ;) ... But no I'm not gonna pull the racist-card.

    This is simply a video messing with the immigrants who haven't assimilated yet, our politicians, and how todays society works.
    Sure it might be offensive, but definitively not racist. It is just humor with plain language and it can and has been targeted at any kind of ethnicity, culture or religion before. Just because it's turks or arabs this time doesn't make it racist.


    u fakin racist go back to germany
    image
  • edited 3:55PM
    eggzor wrote:

    u fakin racist go back to germany



    y u so dumb
  • GnoberGnober Senior
    edited 3:55PM
    Hellsten wrote:

    There's nothing in this video stating that muslims, immigrants or any kind of ethnicity would be of less worth than another.

    Enzo wrote:

    Why do these Turkish people all look like fat trolls?
  • The NibelungThe Nibelung Senior
    edited June 2014
    snip
  • Khaotic'Khaotic' Dinah #1 Senior
    edited 3:55PM
    Lego wrote:

    y u so dumb

    y u no understand
  • lillemakkenlillemakken Senior, senior
    edited 3:55PM
    I can understand it. It's a cool video.

    Thanks for showing, Hellsten.
    According to pvkii.com/forums,
    - Reaching enemies beyond your weapon model isn't a problem(you're just bad at dodging!)
    - Archer isn't overpowered
    - Higher post count is equivalent to higher skill, experience and knowledge in-game
  • edited 3:55PM
    Judging from the video only, I think the "Scandinavian" people need to discuss the right approach on immagration-based topics a bit further. The biggest group of immigrants are Italian and Turkish people in Germany. I remember we had all these "jokes" about Italians and later about our Turkish population, but those were mainly based on certain funny behaviors. I don't think most of the Turkish people find that video funny. Who would like himself to be portrayed as a fat and ugly "trollish" creature?
  • The NibelungThe Nibelung Senior
    edited June 2014
    snip
  • R-PhoenixR-Phoenix Simpering Beggar Senior
    edited 3:55PM
    Even if both swedish, Denshin and Squirrel talk in public text/voice chat in english even to each other. I really appreciate this. ^^
    I'm Resurrected Phoenix, #1 Europe HEIÐRIK KONG Fan and Founder of European-Canadian Alliance.
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  • edited 3:55PM
    Hellsten wrote:

    It is only preventing the politicians from discussing the immigration and integration problems. Because there are problems, only a fool would deny it. The ghettos forming and the crime rate increasing is a proof of that.


    It always causes problems. The more different cultures are, the longer and harder the integration process, usually. It's still a normal process and takes a bit of time and a lot of respect for each other.
  • Lacquer HeadLacquer Head Members, Senior
    edited 3:55PM
    As much as i agree with your position that Swedish immigration politics are f*cked up and irresponsible, and as much as i've laughed at metalmattes videos, his videos ARE racist and islamophobic (yes, racism and offensiveness can be funny). This one is a lot more constructive and less offensive than his others, but even this one is to some degree.

    There's nothing in this video stating that muslims, immigrants or any kind of ethnicity would be of less worth than another.


    Blattar bråk del 17 (Twisten)


    "Blatte" is a swedish term that would aproxemately translate to "nigger", but rather referring to people from middle eastern countries instead of black people. It's most often interpreted as an offensive word even though it's sometimes used by people in a non-offensive, just like "nigger"/"nigga". "Bråk" means "brawl" or "fight". Also the general way that middle eastern immigrants are pictured in this video IS racist, this is undeniable fact.

    tags: ...moské muslimer...


    Why would he tag his videos with this if he wasn't targeting muslims? Now, this specific video might not have anything in it that is clearly offensive towards muslims (as a lot of his other videos), but what does the tags imply?


    Metalmattes videos are fun, well done, and of comical value. But they are NOT something that should be used as an argument in the immigration/intergration debate. If you show hatred and disrespect towards a group of people, how do you expect them to respond? It's like trying to put out a fire using gasoline. Do NOT mix up comical racism/offensiveness with constructive arguments, this will only backfire and make it all worse. The problem is that a lot of people resort to hatred and ignorance instead of respect and understanding, both immigration critics, immigrant groups, muslims and other religious groups, and political people of all sorts.

    Also, please rename this thread to something more to the point. I am a proud swede and scandinavian, but just because of this i don't want to be associated with hate and racism.
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  • PerspectivePerspective Senior
    edited 3:55PM
    Holy shirley i hate musicals
  • GeeMachineGeeMachine Senior
    edited 3:55PM
    I like the Vacuum Cleaner mouth part HAHAHAAH!!! Then the guy Poops in the floor and the janitor has to clean it up D: HAH!! Aw hes in jail sad times lol
  • The NibelungThe Nibelung Senior
    edited June 2014
    snip
  • Lacquer HeadLacquer Head Members, Senior
    edited December 2012
    Hellsten wrote:

    I think you're turning the tables here. It's not about islam. It's about all cultures eliminating the Swedish culture. There's always been migrates to Sweden and I'm sure there will always be to some extent. The immigrants before actually became Swedes and embraced our customs. Sadly, today that is not happening because of the large scale immigration that started in early 90s, and it is what gives us this segregated society we have today.


    Yeah, i heard the nice catholic judeo-christian pope-sectoid immigrant visitors about 1100 years ago embraced our customs and respected our culture and religion. They even encouraged us to build some nice "churches" for some "lord", which of course required some gentle motivations (like drowning and decapitating every filthy pagan heathen inhibitant who refused to accept their new god). The swedes must have been very open minded because today we've even got the symbol of that "lord" on our national banner and paganism is almost gone! What a respectful and lovable embracement!

    Turning the tables eh...


    The unwise man weens all who smile
    and flatter him are his friends,
    nor notes how oft they speak him ill
    when he sits in the circle of the wise.



    This video is making fun out of immigrants. As if you didn't know this already, the majority of immigrants in Swedens are in fact muslims. It's a matter of reaching out to as many as possible.


    "In fact" is a term used when you have facts to back up your statement, not when you don't. There are no records of which religion our immigrants belong to, the only records we've got are country of birth, gender, and age. If you very roughly count all the statistics up, you'll find out that the majority (2/3 or so) are probably NOT muslim based on their country of birth. In fact.

    You are absolutely right. But when people instantly dispatch it as racist I feel I have to enlighten them. I can agree that It is definitively discriminating, but it is NOT racist! People need to understand the meaning of racism.


    www.youtube.com/watch?v=ltBMzSHLwDk
    www.youtube.com/watch?v=olTDL6Q83nQ
    www.youtube.com/watch?v=maXttj4IZAA
    And so on...

    The people pictured in the blattar bråk movies all have something in common; dark skin and hair, foreign accents, hostility towards "swedes", lack of intelligence, violent behaviour, foreign cultural attributes, etc... ...but it's "NOT racist"? Maybe you're not really in position to "enlighten" people when you are in a desperate need of some illumination youself..

    I don't know where you live but where I live there is parts which are heavy immigrant populated. There is a lot of hatred toward Swedes, and the law against incitement to racial hatred applies to all ethnicities except the swedish. Yes, that is in the actual swedish law - Go ahead and look it up. And this law was presented to prevent the separation of swedes and any immigrating ethnicity and in the fight against racism. Yet this law itself separates "them" from "us".


    I live in the second largest city, Gothenburg that is. I've lived in quite a few of the "bad" places. The places where the immigrant gangs burn up cars in the summer and throw stones at the cops/firetrucks, places with low rates of employment and high rate of immigrants, yeah, you know. Yet I've never gotten in trouble just because I'm obviously swedish...

    I guess you're referring to the "Hets mot folkgrupp" law (hate speech)? Right, first of all let's be real. The law is not about discrimination between common men, but rather it's used when people publish and distribute information that discriminates people based on race, religion, or sexuality. Examples (Taken from the swedish wikipedia) on when people have been convicted:

    * Someone put up a sign outside a camping site saying that gypsies are not allowed. - Guilty
    * Someone who distributed flyers saying that homosexuality is promiscuous and a sorce of HIV, AIDS, and paedophilia. - Guilty
    * Someone wore clothing with the Swastika (as used by Nazi Germany) and other symbols related to nazism. - Guilty

    How about this public speech then? "Our society is being islamisized, muslim immigrants attack swedes, women, jews, and homosexuals. If this is their "thank you" to us then I've only got one thing to say: Go home!" - Not guilty.

    The law is usually irrelevant for the common man. The relevant laws are discrimination, harassment, and defamation laws. And even those are usually irrelevent. Let me ask you, how many times have you reported such a crime? Or heard someone you know report such a crime? How many times have you been told by the court that you are not a "victim group" and thus the defendant can't be charged? Have you ever been to court? It's all a ghost, the law has no real effect on the arguments that people are trying to use it for, but is still used over and over and over again falsely.

    Oh, i know a guy who have been, at least, reported for this crime though - simply for wearing a SS uniform in public. No hate, no violence, just a uniform. That's where the law has any real effect. I don't think you would even become convicted if you were to wear a Muhammed-caricature-shirt in public (which is EXTREMELY offensive towards muslims) while a tilted sun cross is equal to sentence. Communist symbols of all kinds - no problem. Now that is where this law is a bit strange, pragmatically.

    You don't have to be so defensive trying to convince everyone you're not racist. Apparently being racist is worse than death and it's what the politicians fear the most in our countries today, forcing them to avoid important political questions such as the immigration politics even when it's not even a question of racism to begin with. The "racist" party SD wouldn't even have the need to exist if the other parties could just discuss these matters in a mature and responsible manner. They are the voice of our country and yet they cower in fear when questions like this come up. They lie flat down. I can tell you, that's not the type of government I want for my country.


    I do have to and i am going to - because racism is fridgeing stupid and destructive. Racism of all kind from any race directed to any race. On the political stuff, i completely agree. But this is rather because politics is basically a marketing race and it would be strategically wrong for any party to speak up against it. It's a taboo just like speaking up against feminism is, and therefore no mainstream career-politician is going to say a word if that's the best thing to do. Until SD came of course. But you have to have this in mind - SD wouldn't have gotten into the parliament if they didn't say things that were strategically correct to some extent too. It's all about popularity. "Believe nothing, no matter where you read it or who has said it, not even if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense."

    I use my voice and debate for my cause instead of hiding in fear of what they might call me. We live in a democracy. If people can't meet me in a serious debate without just spewing out epithets, it only proves they have no arguments for their cause.
    I know I am right. And I know many Scandinavians think of these matters too, they just don't dare show it. Perhaps soon they will.


    You "use your voice and debate for your cause" in "serious debates"? Well, that's good. Can't see how it is related to the movie that you were linking to though. Or how it all relates to "scandinavians". With all respect i think that you're a bit confused, you have to see the bigger picture from a more objective point of view. Speak up! But think about it long and hard before you do rather than blurting out stuff that "kind of seems right". Because that's what make the difference between a honest man and a fool.
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  • edited 3:55PM
    booooooring
  • JollygreenJollygreen Troll Senior
    edited 3:55PM
    homosexuella jävlar var snälla mot varandra
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  • The NibelungThe Nibelung Senior
    edited June 2014
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  • Lacquer HeadLacquer Head Members, Senior
    edited February 2012
    Hellsten wrote:

    I've never said I liked Christianity, in fact I dislike it very much and I wish it would never had set root in Sweden in the first place. But that was as you said about 1100 years ago and sadly I can't do anything about that now. However it encourages me to do what I can to stop other cultures from crippling the Swedish one any further.


    So you dislike very much the very same culture that is the basis of the current culture in Sweden? And you want to defend it? Let's imagine this; islam "takes over" Sweden and in 300 years we have switched from a secular christian state to a secular muslim state. The lutheran church of Sweden is replaced with an islamic organization, and even though we don't have shari'a laws and most people are not practicing the faith, the islamic culture and core beliefs have replaced the lutheran christian ones. Nobody considers the Swedish culture "crippled" but rather think that it's all natural and that they can't do anything about it even though some think that the way it took over was brutal and wrongful. In this imagined future, a lot of hinduist immigrants are migrating to Sweden and they start building temples and practice their culture, which causes some conflict between them and the Swedish secular islamic culture due to differences. If you lived in this time, would you defend the Swedish culture? Would you do what you could to stop those hindu bastards from "crippling our culture" and being encouraged to do so due to the transition from lutheran christianity to islam? Because what you're saying is really basically the very same thing. The only thing that separates the current swedish lutheran christian culture from the norse mythology (asatro) culture is time. "Crippling" is also a very strange term in this context as it suggests that cultural changes per se is destructive... And that the flow of time is inevitabley destroying our society. I don't mean that i want islam to "take over", i just point out the pure technical facts and that they are somewhat irrational.

    Yes? I'm sorry but I can't really classify Swedes returning to Sweden as real immigrants. Iraqis are in fact on second place. And how many Iraqis are not muslims? I'm convinced the majority of Iraqis are muslims.


    Even if we disregard the returning swedes the supposed muslims are still not in majority, even though iraqis and somalis are the biggest groups if you look at single countries of birth.

    "Blattar" or immigrants in general isn't an ethnicity so no, it is not racist. I've already agreed to it being discriminating against immigrants, which it is and that's the whole point of it, making fun of them. And by them I of course don't refer to all of the immigrants, but the stereotypical and troublesome ones. There's nowhere in his videos stated that all immigrants look and behave like this. I shouldn't even need to explain that, but you seem to try so hard to make this look racist.


    Apply the same logic to "nigger" and you will find out that the word "nigger" is in fact not racist. Impeccable logic!

    lol


    You have a strange sense of humor too!

    So it may be, but it is still wrong to exclude the Swedish ethnicity and I do not understand the reason for doing so.


    More to the point, you do not understand the law at all, and swedes are not really excluded at all. Don't believe everything you read on Flashback or Politisk Inkorrekt or whatever site you get your disinformation from, because it's very often not valid.

    Then why defend the way the law for incitement to racial hatred currently works? If anything it is only counterproductive in the fight against racism.


    I have not "defended" anything and as i said, the law is irrelevant to your point and that is what i pointed out. I "defended" the fact that the law is not what you think it is.

    It's relevant because most scandinavians can recognize the situation and understand what is being said, to some extent.


    "lol". Most scandinavians think that a pink pachyderm named Sven-Jezebel should become the sole ruler of Sweden and overthrow the thin-skinned scum that is infiltrating our dermocracy (pun intended). I know that and most scandinavians do too but they are afraid of speaking of it because they don't want to be labeled as skinists.

    As a final statement I would like to convince you that I'm not racist. I think every culture and religion has the right to exist, just not in the same place. Multiculturalism is the reaper of cultures and doesn't let cultures evolve on their own without too much influence of others. I love travelling, and much of the joy is to experience different cultures and the ways of that nations people, and the reason I have no interest in going to the US is just because of that, multiculturalism. Nothing charming there, nothing unique to that country. I'm a nationalist in favor of all nations and the right to defend their ways. I don't wish other cultures and religions gone from my country because of hate - but because of love, to my own culture and my peoples customs.


    In other words you are a culture-pluralist. Nothing wrong with that, in fact i agree to a certain extent. However i think that the real point you're trying to make is that the swedish immigration/intergration politics are f**cked up and destructive, which i also agree to to a certain extent. However i think you should take more points of view into consideration, like the fact that those immigrants really are of the same opinion. The source of the problem is NOT the immigrants, or the swedes, it is the goverment and the politics. Blaming each other leads to nothing more than division and hate while the ones running it all thankfully doesn't get the lot of the criticism and blame. This works in both ways of course, there are a lot of immigrants doing the very same thing. What if we all would come together and direct all of that towards the ones in charge? In that way we could discard all the "fridgeing svennar" and "fridgeing blattar" and instead go for "fridgeing goverment", and make some acctual change without resorting to hate and "racism"/"culturalism" or whatever you want to call it. At least we could work towards a better start then, making the immigrants intergrated to our society and culture which would benefit both swedes and immigrants. Wouldn't that be better?
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  • The NibelungThe Nibelung Senior
    edited June 2014
    snip
  • Lacquer HeadLacquer Head Members, Senior
    edited 3:55PM
    Hellsten wrote:

    You forget that a large chunk of the Norse culture, values, feasts and traditions still lives on through the christianization of Sweden and other Scandinavian countries too for that matter. Cultural values ​​tend to be relatively constant over time, and thereby promote continuity and solidarity in a society. These cultural values is a heavy foundation of how a nation is built and ruled. Cultural changes are destructive simply because the culture is an indirect definition of a nation. Naturally people with remote cultures and values are likely to have a more or less different view on society and how it should work. This is definite and can be seen if we look at other countries and their cultural history. Sadly, the lack of cultural confidence is likely to have something to do with the direction Sweden is going today.


    What values and traditions? Midsummar and pickled herring? Back in the "pagan" days we had thralls, blood feuds, death penalties, animal (and possibly human) sacrifice to the æsirs, not to mention all the seaways warfare and plunderings like Lindisfarne (we got our revenge on those christians before they even crusaded into our pagan lands ;)). "But that's sick!"? Of course it is today, because we are now christian and killing someone is against the holy teachings of the judeo-christian prophet Moses and the rabbi-nazarene-god-son Jesus Christ! Sure there are some minor traditional practices left but the society in large is undoubtedly lutheran christian.

    I very much agree with your notion on the fact that traditional swedish/norse culture is being eroded and forgotten, along with all sense of our nationalism and heritagal pride. This is very sad and i think that it is also a part of the source of all the problems we are facing today. People are lost and scattered, instead of being proud swedes we tend to turn to some political/cultural/religious group to get the sense of identity that we don't get for just being swedish. And in turn, this causes internal conflicts instead of companionship.

    I would like to hear you explain how the law works and how swedes aren't "really" excluded when it literally is stated to be so by the general attorney.

    Everyone should be equal before the law and this is in the constitution of Sweden, if I remember correctly. Yet the general attorney does not recognize the Ethnic Swede's existence.
    Discrimination Act Chapter1 § 5 says that ethnicity is ethnic or national origin, color or other similar relationship. Why can not the Swedes be classed as a group of national origin, and thus can be discriminated against because of their origin?

    You say I don't understand the law - How much clearer can the law get? This is discrimination in its pure form.


    What do you mean swedes are no a group of national origin? They are as much as any other ethnic group, technically. This is exactly how clear the law can get, as you see there is no mention about swedes being excluded:

    8 § Den som i uttalande eller i annat meddelande som sprids hotar eller uttrycker missaktning för folkgrupp eller annan sådan grupp av personer med anspelning på ras, hudfärg, nationellt eller etniskt ursprung, trosbekännelse eller sexuell läggning, döms för hets mot folkgrupp till fängelse i högst två år eller om brottet är ringa, till böter.
    Är brottet grovt döms till fängelse i lägst sex månader och högst fyra år. Vid bedömande av om brottet är grovt skall särskilt beaktas om meddelandet haft ett särskilt hotfullt eller kränkande innehåll och spritts till ett stort antal personer på ett sätt som varit ägnat att väcka betydande uppmärksamhet. Lag (2002:800).






    And I am by no means blaming the immigrants for the segregated, fridgeed up and political correct society we live in today. I blame media and retarded politicians who are blindly suggesting that somehow this mass-immigration is good. I don't want to slow down the immigration solely because of immigrants with cultures distant to the Swedish one, or because I dislike the fact that our society adjusts to their needs rather than them adjusting their lives to our society, or even because of the lack of equal rights for all citizens, immigrants or not. What about the amount of resources spent on this immigration? How many are we actually helping? Could we help more? Those really in the need of help doesn't get it. Most of those who migrate here isn't in desperate need of help, they're just family with other immigrants who were already approved of residence. They were only a few lucky that got a ticket to a another life. Even if we were to raise our immigration to a number that would absolutely overwhelm our nation we couldn't make a noticeable difference. We're not fighting the source of this problem. We need to help them build up their nations and society so that they can live and relish with their own people and customs. That's what I want for them and all countries in the world, and I'm sure they want it too. Even if we continue ignoring those in need, we can't forget that this type of immigration still has a negative impact on our society. Immigration can never be an effective or significant way to deal with the suffering people in the world. They need to be helped where they live.


    I largely agree with this too. This is a good summary of the swedish immigrant politics and it's clear to most sane swedes why it is irresponsible and not sustainable. And yes, immigration from war affected countries doesn't solve anything at all for more than the lucky 0.001% or so who manage flee to another country, it's political issues that need to be solved there. But even though all that, the fact is that we have hundred of thousands of immigrants here right now. That's how it is and we can't just send them all back even if it would be good for us all. Instead, we have to integrate them into our society and make them a part of Sweden. The part of Sweden that they are supposed to be, but often are not because of our worthless and fridgeed up immigration politics. I think the vast majority of immigrants who come here want to have jobs, learn swedish, learn our culture and live as swedes rather than "immigrants" in a 90% immigrant suburb where the majority is unemployed and relatively poor and crime rates are high. It all causes frustration and disappointment from both swedes and immigrants and ultimately division and racism. This is why such things should not be used in the debate, but rather hard and constructive criticism directed towards the goverment and politicians.
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  • The NibelungThe Nibelung Senior
    edited June 2014
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  • Lacquer HeadLacquer Head Members, Senior
    edited 3:55PM
    Hellsten wrote:

    Quoting the attorney general;
    "Syftet vid tillkomsten av straffstadgandet om hets mot folkgrupp var att tillförsäkra minoritetsgrupper av skilda sammansättningar och bekännare av olika trosuppfattningar ett rättsskydd. Det fallet att någon uttrycker kritik mot svenskar torde inte ha varit avsett att träffas av straffstadgandet."

    What do you make of that?


    As i said the law you're mentioning is not really of much importance to your point. Sure, the pure technical and theoretical facts about swedes being excluded from it could be seen as racism against swedes (it depends on what you define as a swede) but in reality that law is rarely used. Other more frequently used juridical measures do not make any difference between swedes and people of other ethnic groups. Some examples:

    (Diskrimineringsombudsmannen)
    DO, Dnr 460-2005 – En svensk man sökte en tjänst som croupier på en färja mellan Sverige och Polen med nekades platsen eftersom företaget "uteslutande anställde polska kvinnor för fast tjänstgöring på färjorna". Efter förlikning utbetalades skadestånd på 80 000 kronor till mannen.

    (Lag (2001:1286) om likabehandling av studenter i högskolan)
    Mål nr T400-06 – Uppsala universitet fälls för diskrinimering av två svenska kvinnor som tvingats avstå sina utbildingsplatser vid Uppsala universitet till förmån för sämre meritierade sökanden med utländsk bakgrund.

    (Centrum för rättvisa)
    2011-11-09 | Simon Wallmark som nekades ett jobb som brandman för att han hade fel kön och fel etnisk bakgrund fick i dag full upprättelse. Södertörns Brandförsvarsförbund, SBFF, gick vid en förlikning i tingsrätten med på att betala hela det yrkade beloppet om 100 000 kronor.


    Point is, always dig a bit deeper and always research some more. Don't let yourself be played like a pawn just because something you read upsets you at first glance. "Don't believe everything you read in the paper". Just like on Wikipedia/Google or in the media etc, that which seems to be the most "popular" and "relevant" information is rather the information that the ones with power and money want you to believe. Because the ones who are writing the news, SEO:ing Google, watching Wikipedia topics and so on, are most often not the most righteous and honest ones with a completely unbiased agenda. It's the ones who have a reason and enough resources to do so. The shepherds of the flock so to say.
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